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So much for high tec gear

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So much for high tec gear

Postby saddlesore » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 1]

I think we put to much emphasis on this stuff.Example.When I tagged that bull I got this year, I had to have help lifting the hind quarters off the mule. Two guys camped next to me did it for me.They hadn't seen any elk. The older fellow had been on an elk hunt with the local outfitter previously and had his son (mid 30's )with him.So I volunteered to get him on elk the next day,if he would be ready to ride at 4:30 the next morning.

They weren't quite ready,but we made it in time for me to get them set before first light.
I got the older one set at a big rock that would be a good rest and pointed out where to watch for the elk and got the son set where a herd of elk came thru last year. I went back to the mules and waited awhile before leaving to pickup the rest of my elk.

I was all set to mount up when I heard this barrage if about ten rounds coming from where they were at.So I hustled over there after the shooting stopped and he said he had one laying up there in the brush,but was watching the rest of the herd that had few bulls in it.
Figuring the two of them could take care of the elk. I left to pack the rest of mine.In about an hour ,I came back thru and they are criss crossing the hill side.I ride over and there is no elk.He had blown every shot over a bulls back,but must have nicked a vertebrae to knock it over,but it got up and ran off .Very little blood and it stopped within 50 yards.

He had one of those big objective scopes that must have been 4-16x and had adjustable turrets on it and a range finder.Evidently he ranged on something above the elk (it was an uphill shot of about 20 degrees,) and then set his turrets for that range.I think it said 600 yards. Well it was about 450 and less since he was shooting uphill. All he had to do was hold high,buy not above the hair line and he would have toppled that bull. This area,you get one shot maybe a year at a bull, and many times don't see anything and he depends on his techy stuff instead of common sense. I bet he went home empty handed,because those elk left the country.

I had a 70 year old rifle a 2-8 scope and a cheap pair of mini binos. I did have phone to keep in touch with my wide since I was hunting solo.
A lot of guys IMHO,would be better off learning to shoot their firearm ( or bow) an estimating distances better and leave all that stuff at home.They probably spent $3000 on that hunt coming from TX hunt and had $4000 n gear and got zip
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Tigger » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 2]

I am not sure it was a gear problem, it sounds like it was a lack of preparedness problem. If he would have spent the time to know how to use his gear or as you suggest learn to estimate distance, he would have gotten that bull. The problem is that people think high tech gear can compensate for lack of effort, preparing for the hunt, and knowledge. It obviously does not. In fact, most times, if you have high tech gear you need to put MORE effort into learning how to use it. Good observation.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby RAMMONT » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 3]

I agree, it wasn't the high tech gear that failed, it was the dope behind the scope.

Most people don't have a clue about the ballistics of a firearm and more often than not the average hunter goes to the field after firing less than 20 rounds for the entire year from their "hunting" rifle. I used to work at a gun range that had a "Zeromatic", a silly gun mount that was advertised to zero your rifle perfectly. I used to tell people to not waste their time and money on the thing because all it did was zero the scope mechanically at 100 yards from a bench rest, it did nothing to teach the shooter how their ammo performed or how to shoot the rifle properly. But invariably a ton of guys would show up the week before hunting season the get their rifle "zeroed" with this gadget and then they'd go home without even testing the rifle with a single shot.

Gadgets are helpful but as the previous poster said, you need more practice time with them to ensure that you know how to use them properly.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Swede » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 4]

I think High Tec clothing is great for some extreme conditions. I think it is way over sold and it will never replace skill on the part of the hunter.
Some things have been improved and make the hunting experience better. I am glad to have a cell phone so I can stay out for days on end and can check in daily. My pack frame is far superior to what I had for years. Even my bow is better than we had years ago. These things do not replace hunter skill.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Jhg » 11 08, 2018 •  [Post 5]

Tech-diapers help people arrive in the elk woods unprepared. Its not the fault of the device but it is the myth we buy into that we need its help to harvest an animal.

Instead of putting the time in we put our money down. I am all for spending our money- we earned it after all. But we lay down that green and think we have just made hunting better and do not consider what we just gave up in the bargain.

I get pretty riled up around the trend toward using tech-advances when they replace skill and knowledge and we move away from woodsmanship. What are we out there for anyway? How hard is it to judge distances for example? Pretty hard if you don't learn how to do it in the woods. But all these skills that you need to learn to succeed deepens the experience.

With the effort comes the ethic and the love of the sport.

Thats my belief and I hope I have not offended anyone. We can debate endlessly about what determines too much or too little reliance on advances in gear, but that just takes the focus off what is really at issue. At issue is learning vs relying. Woodsmanship is a goal well worth spending a lifetime working at. There is always more to learn. That makes hunting interesting.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Swede » 11 08, 2018 •  [Post 6]

I still remember my first camp out hunt. The first night it was freezing. I slept well in an army surplus sleeping bag. The temperature was in the teens by morning, but I had no problem. When I left camp, I had on some wool and stayed toasty warm all day. It was layered just like we do nearly 60 years later, but the same clothes worked well for me at home. We had no money for special hunting garb.
I never thought anything about special hunting gear, except for some red coat or hat so I could be seen. Wearing red around home only meant you were a hunter. It was something like a badge or WapitiTalk logo on your shirt.
It was many years before I got rain gear, and it was the same stuff I wore at work. It was the same stuff construction workers wore, and I suspect the same as what WaWhitey wears on the boat. It was good, but not high tec. I stayed warm, but it did not wick away perspiration or reduce odor well. I guess you sacrifice something when your coat and pants cost less that your fully equipped rifle.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Indian Summer » 11 08, 2018 •  [Post 7]

All of the new fangled gadgets will NEVER replace skill and experience.

But the right clothing makes hunting easier physically. Lighter and less bulky it makes the old stuff seem like a ball and chain.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby saddlesore » 11 11, 2018 •  [Post 8]

I think JHG capured it perfectly
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Swede » 11 12, 2018 •  [Post 9]

I went back and reread Jhg's last post on this thread. He nailed it alright. Well said.
What probably bugs me about the high tech stuff is that it is pushed so hard, and people not acquainted with hunting and working in the forests think it is very important, or vital to have the newest and greatest. Do I need the ultimate in wicking ability that the new cloth offers to sit in my stand? Is it vital that it minimizes residual odor? I just want warm, comfortable, and non-bulky clothes especially above my waist. That was around 60 years ago. I worked a career with quality clothes that were comfortable, wicked away moisture and lasted for years. Most of what I see have some point(s) of improvement. I doubt they beat good wool across the board, but they have something. Is it worth the extra cost? I will let others decide for themselves, but I will say much of it is just backed by salesmanship.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Tigger » 11 13, 2018 •  [Post 10]

Swede, in addition, I think many people mis-apply the new stuff. For example, it took many, many years before people understood that Gore-Tex is not going to keep you warm. I cannot count how many times I heard people say, "I bought a Gore-Tex coat so I am going to be toasty this year!"---uh, no. It will keep you dry but Gore-Tex is not an insulator. And unless you get sweaty walking in, you sure don't need a wicking layer on a tree stand.
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby saddlesore » 11 13, 2018 •  [Post 11]

One thing I do buy is every year Walmart puts their Wrangler fleece shirts on sale for $15-$16 s.They are 1/2 the weight of wool, just as warm and water proof,but not quite as breathable as wool. Darn site cheaper though.Usually too warm to wear above 20 degrees F
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Re: So much for high tec gear

Postby Swede » 11 13, 2018 •  [Post 12]

There is no warmth in Gore-Tex and it won't keep your feet dry after your boots are broke in. I have worn Gore-Tex lined boots for years, and if I want dry feet, a bread sack is needed to keep the moisture out. I have several pairs of high end underwear. It is nearly as warm as wool without the itch. Tree stand hunting tends to be cold. I have a pair of Carhart insulated bib overalls. I think I will try them next season. After reading WaWhitie's post on his Sitka overall experience, that alone will save me over $1,600.
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