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Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

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Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 15, 2017 •  [Post 1]

Hey y'all. I am hoping to get some opinions on what people feel they have had out of the package SCARY sharp broadheads. I traditionally have shot fixed 3 blade broadheads but I am open to others too. I have been shooting Muzzy MX3 and they have performed well for me but am always looking for a new toy I guess. The last 2 elk I have killed,the ferrule busted, so I am keeping one eye on those bheads.
I just bought another 3 of the Shuttle T in 125....the other I had in the past were 100 grains. I really am not happy with the sharpness out of the package the Shuttle Ts are and I am not very good with a stone or any sharpener for that matter. Their blade shape also would be hard to work on I think. Ideally a bhead would be crazy sharp out of the gate so I am looking for opinions on what people have liked for sharpness right out of the package. Thoughts???
Thanks!
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby WapitiTalk1 » 03 15, 2017 •  [Post 2]

Ya, unfortunately the replaceable blade BH's don't always come razor sharp but most aren't bad I spose. I have several varieties of hand held sharpeners that do a good job touching up these types of BH's (one pictured below is a Lansky). I know, a guy shouldn't have to touch up a brand new BH! I remember the old Wasp BHs were very, very sharp out of the package (side note). Curious to see what others say as far as "out of the package" very sharp BH's.

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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby TimeOnTarget » 03 16, 2017 •  [Post 3]

The last sharp out of the pack heads i used were muzzy 3 blades. The originals.

The last ones i felt were some new ones my dad had bought, they werent anything special i didnt think. Muzzy trocars are not super sharp either.


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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby N&N Waterfowl » 03 16, 2017 •  [Post 4]

A big fan of VPA broadheads. They are pretty sharp out of the package, but with just a little work they can be made scary sharp!!
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby jmez » 03 16, 2017 •  [Post 5]

G5 Striker and it's not even close.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Roosiebull » 03 16, 2017 •  [Post 6]

if I ever wanted to go back to a replaceable blade 3 blade, it would be hard not to try exodus with all of the great reviews...I don't think I have ever seen anything bad said about them, from forgiveness, to sharpness, toughness, and performance on live animals.....which is rare for a broadhead, most that have a strong following, also have a strong following of people who don't like them.

I have never shot them, the last 3 blades I shot were muzzy, and I shot them for several years, but there are a bunch of better options, though I never had one cost me an animal.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby DBLGBL » 03 17, 2017 •  [Post 7]

I have yet to see a broad head that is "scalpel sharp" out of the package. I'm a VPA fan because of their toughness and the fact that you can make them scalpel sharp with minimal effort even when the have been shot into something other than meat and hair. :shock: :shock:

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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby jmez » 03 17, 2017 •  [Post 8]

Like with everything there are trade off's. The sharper the blade the more fragile the edge and the quicker and less durable that edge is going to be.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby DBLGBL » 03 17, 2017 •  [Post 9]

If they pass the "Pill bottle"test, I am happy. Stretch 4 rubber band across a pill bottle in a square pattern. Push your broad head down thru. You will know if it is sharp.

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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 17, 2017 •  [Post 10]

DBLGBL wrote:If they pass the "Pill bottle"test, I am happy. Stretch 4 rubber band across a pill bottle in a square pattern. Push your broad head down thru. You will know if it is sharp.

2gbl


That's a cool trick. I hadn't heard of that before.

Rosiebull.....that is funny because I just got done reading an article from a magazine and the Exodus was the "Editor's Choice." I might try them....the only con I have read was flight issues (Cabelas reviews I think) but most of the time that is from peeps not having the proper tune. That isn't the bheads fault! I tend to think if 10 people say they fly great and one says terrible....it isn't the bhead. lol

Thanks for all the replies people!!!

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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Beendare » 03 17, 2017 •  [Post 11]

Sharpest is always going to be one of the thin replaceable blade heads.

Sharpest out of the pack is not a factor i consider. The thin blades always feel sharper than the stronger thicker blades just because of the skinny bevel. They feel sharper but dull faster.

I don't get the cart before the horse. I shoot every single hunting arrow anyway to confirm perfect flight, then i deal with sharp.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby N&N Waterfowl » 03 18, 2017 •  [Post 12]

Beendare wrote:
Sharpest out of the pack is not a factor i consider. The thin blades always feel sharper than the stronger thicker blades just because of the skinny bevel. They feel sharper but dull faster.

I don't get the cart before the horse. I shoot every single hunting arrow anyway to confirm perfect flight, then i deal with sharp.


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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 18, 2017 •  [Post 13]

Beendare wrote:Sharpest is always going to be one of the thin replaceable blade heads.

Sharpest out of the pack is not a factor i consider. The thin blades always feel sharper than the stronger thicker blades just because of the skinny bevel. They feel sharper but dull faster.

I don't get the cart before the horse. I shoot every single hunting arrow anyway to confirm perfect flight, then i deal with sharp.


I agree in part with you. I shoot each combo before it goes in my quiver. They get touched up or blades replaced after I am confident they are flying perfect. I just like to start with a broadhead that either has a good edge from the beginning or lends having a razor sharp edge. Some broadheads are not easily sharpened due to design or poor materials. I like to start with a good cart.....I know my workhorse is perfectly tuned and tolerant of many bhead designs. If you have a crummy horse...that's something you won't have good success with no mater what.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby >>>---WW----> » 03 19, 2017 •  [Post 14]

As the name implies, Beendare has Been Dare! Easy to tell from some of his post. I agree with him. Put em on your arrow and worry about sharpening them after they fly straight. I never worry about a hair splitting sharp head holding up. It only has to make one cut anyhow.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 19, 2017 •  [Post 15]

>>>---WW----> wrote:As the name implies, Beendare has Been Dare! Easy to tell from some of his post. I agree with him. Put em on your arrow and worry about sharpening them after they fly straight. I never worry about a hair splitting sharp head holding up. It only has to make one cut anyhow.


This might sound harsh....but I really don't care. I couldn't care less where you have been. Please don't highjack my thread! If you can't comment on what experience you have in finding a sharp out of the package bhead then move along and start a thread on what you think you need to consider first or last or in the middle. I am looking for comments (as per the post question) on sharp bheads from the get go. I like the Shuttle T bheads for it's attributes but it is pretty dull out of the gate. It isn't an easy blade to touch up either. If I wanted to know what you are looking for in a bhead I would have asked that.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Brendan » 03 20, 2017 •  [Post 16]

Sharpest out of the package - of the ones I've tried are the G5 Striker and Wac 'Em. Wac 'Em has also flown the most consistently of every fixed blade I've tried. Expect to touch up the broadhead tip and replace the blades after you put one through an animal or use it for practice - pretty much single use blades. If I had to choose a fixed blade today - for me it would be the Wac 'Em. I have not tried slick trick - but they are on my list to try if I find a good deal on some as I don't think I've ever heard anything bad about them...

It is not the sharpest, but since it was mentioned above: I love the design of the VPA, but they do require sharpening, and I think they do catch the air a little more than some other designs. Going to test them more this year myself.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 20, 2017 •  [Post 17]

Thanks Brendan! Valuable info there. I too am interested in the Slick Tricks as I've heard nothing bad about them either. Right now I am leaning towards the QAD Exodus and Slick Trick. I'm shooting a very forgiving, very well tuned Mathews Halon 32 and so far has flown every broadhead I have tried extremely well. I'm hitting right where my field points are. So my thoughts are start sharp and I have a better chance staying shaving sharp with touch ups. Some bhead designs just don't seem to take well to a stone (not sure if it's the metal they use) or their design is inhibiting to touching up. As I was saying before I was shocked how dull the Shuttle Ts were out of the package. I can shave no arm hair and can put considerable force down with my thumb and not break any skin. Probably not the best method to test sharpnesss....lol. Their blade design isn't easy to get a stone to. I have traditionally used Muzzy MX3 with good results. My last two bulls were dispatched with them but I am always looking for a better mouse trap. There where a few things I'm no terribly happy with them. It would be nice to buy a dozen brands but that would be rather spendy. The nice thing about a forum is there are a lot of folks who have tried a ton of bheads! Thanks again!
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby >>>---WW----> » 03 20, 2017 •  [Post 18]

olympushunt wrote:
>>>---WW----> wrote:As the name implies, Beendare has Been Dare! Easy to tell from some of his post. I agree with him. Put em on your arrow and worry about sharpening them after they fly straight. I never worry about a hair splitting sharp head holding up. It only has to make one cut anyhow.


This might sound harsh....but I really don't care. I couldn't care less where you have been. Please don't highjack my thread! If you can't comment on what experience you have in finding a sharp out of the package bhead then move along and start a thread on what you think you need to consider first or last or in the middle. I am looking for comments (as per the post question) on sharp bheads from the get go. I like the Shuttle T bheads for it's attributes but it is pretty dull out of the gate. It isn't an easy blade to touch up either. If I wanted to know what you are looking for in a bhead I would have asked that.


Ya, that was a (little Harsh)! I was just rolling with the flow of this thread.

Now, on the other hand, The sharpest out of the package head, (SORRY NOT A THREE BLADE) was made back in the late 60s or early 70s when you were still in diapers. There has never been anything sharper before or since. I think the name of it was the Wasp. But not really sure of the name. Anyhow, the main body of the head had a slot that you could put Shick Injector razor blades in. So far as I know, this was the beginning of the idea of replaceable blade heads.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Beendare » 03 20, 2017 •  [Post 19]

Probably the sharpest heavy blade head I've seen was those old German kinetics that the owner Marcus hand sharpened himself....those were a work of art when it comes to sharp.....and the quality steel really meant they held an edge.

I would agree with Brendon on the Wacems...those were better than the ST heads when it came to sharp out of the pack.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 20, 2017 •  [Post 20]

>>>---WW----> wrote:
olympushunt wrote:
>>>---WW----> wrote:As the name implies, Beendare has Been Dare! Easy to tell from some of his post. I agree with him. Put em on your arrow and worry about sharpening them after they fly straight. I never worry about a hair splitting sharp head holding up. It only has to make one cut anyhow.


This might sound harsh....but I really don't care. I couldn't care less where you have been. Please don't highjack my thread! If you can't comment on what experience you have in finding a sharp out of the package bhead then move along and start a thread on what you think you need to consider first or last or in the middle. I am looking for comments (as per the post question) on sharp bheads from the get go. I like the Shuttle T bheads for it's attributes but it is pretty dull out of the gate. It isn't an easy blade to touch up either. If I wanted to know what you are looking for in a bhead I would have asked that.


Ya, that was a (little Harsh)! I was just rolling with the flow of this thread.

Now, on the other hand, The sharpest out of the package head, (SORRY NOT A THREE BLADE) was made back in the late 60s or early 70s when you were still in diapers. There has never been anything sharper before or since. I think the name of it was the Wasp. But not really sure of the name. Anyhow, the main body of the head had a slot that you could put Shick Injector razor blades in. So far as I know, this was the beginning of the idea of replaceable blade heads.


Sorry Bill and Beendare....I do value your guys experience for sure. I will try to keep that under control. lol
Thanks for the ideas. I'm not opposed to a 2 blader....and have often thought about going to that. Here is a question (is it ok to steer away from this thread since I started it? lol) as I have often wondered what is more important....cutting diameter Vs cutting surface. I've thought cutting diameter is a superior aka more vitals/vessels severed. I would prefer and inch and a quarter diameter to 10 inches of cutting surface with a half inch diameter. Does that make sense? Do you guys agree with that? I think most 2 bladers have a decent diameter right? Not to bash those fancy pink cyclone bheads Swede got, as they boast almost 5 inches of cutting surface but that doesn't impress me as the diameter is only on inch. I don't think that is even legal in some states.
By the way Bill....you can ask Swede, I didn't wear diapers. I wore jeans from the get go.....jumped in them both legs at a time. ;)
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Swede » 03 20, 2017 •  [Post 21]

I have followed this thread with interest as I too have problems sharpening dull broadheads. I have several sharpeners, but they don't put a razor edge on.

Now as far as Oly britches are concerned: I believe he was wearing none at all when I first saw him. His mother held him by one foot to keep him from crawling away soon after when he was supposed to be changed. Oly wanted outside before he could stand up to the elements or anything else. Now Oly's 16 month old son is a chip off the old block. He wants to go out and not return for longer than I can pack or push him around.
Maybe by the time he is ready to go bow hunting super sharp broadheads right out of the box will be a given.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Roosiebull » 03 20, 2017 •  [Post 22]

Oly, if you are considering 2 blades, the iron will heads are insane sharp, very very forgiving to shoot. (Not showing form flaws)

I am very content with magnus ser razors...but may not fit your criteria for a perfect head....they do fit mine.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Beendare » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 23]

olympushunt wrote: ..... I have often wondered what is more important....cutting diameter Vs cutting surface. I've thought cutting diameter is a superior aka more vitals/vessels severed. I would prefer and inch and a quarter diameter to 10 inches of cutting surface with a half inch diameter. Does that make sense? Do you guys agree with that?......


Well heres my take....ITS ALL A TRADEOFF....when comparing width vs length, taper...even 2 blade vs 3 blade. So a wide 2 blade has much less resistance going in than a 3 blade has due to its mechanical advantage [think 'wedge']

The good news is with the energy to spare of our modern compounds almost everything works....so its not worth stressing over. If you want to fine tune your bows "system" then it all comes down to matching your bows energy level to your arrow/BH. You can't talk about BH's without considering the whole system.

i can tell you there is far more resistance between a 2 blade and 3 blade. The VPA 150s [2 and 3] I shoot are night and day different in my low energy stickbow....but it becomes MUCH less of a factor in my 70# compound. Now if you go wide and less taper on say a Muzzy MX3....this blade angle is almost pushing as much as its sliding in....it HAS to have more resistance by design. That said, look at how many critters have died to these things!

The real failures we see are the huge mismatches; a untuned compound shooting a light arrow with a very large cutting dia BH....talk about your "System" working against you! Add that the larger cutting dia heads that put more stress on the edge would benefit from a much higher quality of steel...not the case with the vast majority of these relatively cheap heads. [sorry Muzzy!] But in the reverse....a more tapered design puts less pressure on the edge so the steel quality is less important.

Personally, I like a tapered head....and I've seen the benefits in the form of sharper blades through the animal which gives me more penetration, more blood on the ground and less animal reaction to the hit. Whether that is splitting hairs depends on the shot.

In other words....my comments here and on my arrow thread are for the folks wanting an increase in performance over and above what we know already works <grin> In the case of a perfect layup broadside shot....my 'extra' might not matter all that much.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Swede » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 24]

Beendare makes some excellent points. Here is some more information to consider or confuse you. I think he will agree.
Anyone can make a long or short taper broadhead. There is a reason for both. People like Muzzy are making theirs with a chisel point to break through bone easier. They make the short taper so it is easier to tune your bow arrow combination. With fast 300+ ft/sec. arrows, tuning is critical, and most bow shops are not capable of fine tuning your bow. My observation is that some are nearly incompetent and don't even know it. If you don't know what you are doing it becomes impossible to get good arrow flight with a wide, long taper broadhead. BTW: Every bow hack claims to be a master, and will want you to go to them for everything archery. The first sure sign of a bow hack is their bragging or telling you to not touch anything.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Beendare » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 25]

^ good point...another part of your 'System' is ease of tuning and arrow assembly....which of course why the short heads are so popular.

I'm not sure i would agree with the muzzy tip design being better at breaking through bone. I've seen enough of these chisel point heads that were lodged in bone....to think its an advertising slogan only. The wedge shape of a strong 2 blade has always proven to be the best bone breaker in my experience.

here are pics of chisel point heads lodged in bone
2008%20deer%20008%20%28Medium%29.jpg
Muzzy
2008%20deer%20008%20%28Medium%29.jpg (30.54 KiB) Viewed 11429 times

st shoulder800 pix.jpg
you can see how the blade angle dulled this one
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2008%20deer%20008%20%28Medium%29.jpg
Muzzy
2008%20deer%20008%20%28Medium%29.jpg (30.54 KiB) Viewed 11429 times


^^Its simple physics; more blades...less taper creates more resistance [but as I said, in most cases....Meh!]



Now if you are talking thin Whitetail bones an FP can probably be called a "Bone Breaker"...all relative i suppose.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 26]

Beendare......penetration aside do you feel it is more important to get cutting diameter or tissue cut? I'm not sure I am explaining myself well...lol
Years ago do y'all remember those bheads that were like 5 blades? I think they were a cartridge on a ferule. Great for tissue severed I suppose but they didn't have a big diameter. Anyway....I tend to think diameter is more important as you have a better chance at coming into contact with a major vessel, or organ. I agree that more blade is more friction and less penetration but as you said with todays compounds it is probably not a huge deal. Larger diameter heads....be it 2 or 3 blade will make it harder to tune as the "sail" is bigger steering the arrow up front also. You need a finely tuned bow as you have pointed out before. I think some manufactures get better flight characteristics by reducing the "foot print" or "sail" and make more happy customers with better flight, but as I said before some states have diameter requirements for a darn good reason. I don't have much experience with 2 bladers (maybe Rosiebull can give his thoughts too) but are most 2 blade bheads narrowererer than a typical 3 blade....like Muzzy that is 1 and a quarter? Trust me I won't rant about how great Muzzy is. Their 100 MX3 has an aluminum ferule and I've busted the last two on bulls I killed....but that was after the deed was done. It still disturbed me. Oddly their 125 is a steel ferule but has a reduced diameter to 1 and 3/16ths. I find that odd. I like the idea of a steel ferule. I recently have gone to a new arrow. An Easton FMJ 340 at 29.5 inches. To get a better FOC I am now converting to a 125 head that puts me at 13%. I am just over 504 grains now but as you can see I am in the market for new bheads since all I have shot in the past is 100s. I have shot several 3 blade bheads now and all are flying EXTREMELY well so I am not wanting to know what is super sharp and tough as well. I might have to try those Magnus bheads that Rosiebull talked about. I just have been nervous about eliminated cutting diameter. I guess I should look at your and RBs results and be confident. RB...I can look but what are the Magnus diameters???
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby WapitiTalk1 » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 27]

olympushunt wrote:Years ago do y'all remember those bheads that were like 5 blades? I think they were a cartridge on a ferule. Great for tissue severed I suppose but they didn't have a big diameter.


Bear Razorback 5s! I remember folks shooting these back in the day... they actually spun freely on the ferrule (seemed to fly pretty well). Sorry, had to answer your question...... carry on :D
10693d1386946245-old-razorback-broadheads-msevyi_5abuvj9utni880cw.jpg
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Back on topic......Magnus Stinger, 125 grain 2-blade, 2 3/16" X 1 1/8" and Magnus Stinger Buzzcuts, 125 grain 4-blade (actually two blade w/bleeders), 2 3/16" X 1 1/8". The 100 GNs are slightly narrower and slightly shorter than the stats mentioned for the 125 GNs.
Stinger-2-blade__52471__14565_1319661379_1280_1280.jpg
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Stinger_125_4_buzzcut__97237_1308338918_1280_1280.jpg
Stinger_125_4_buzzcut__97237_1308338918_1280_1280.jpg (21.17 KiB) Viewed 11417 times
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 28]

lol!!!! That's awesome RJ. I found one of those once in the woods and thought..."What a nasty looking tool for chewing a major hole in a critter!"

You win the "Been around the block" award for the day sir. Very nice. :D
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby CurlyTail » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 29]

I am going to switch this year to the two blade Magnus Buzzcut. But, I am also going to spend some time paper tuning to make sure I have good arrow flight
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Roosiebull » 03 21, 2017 •  [Post 30]

Oly, the ser razors are 1 1/4" cut
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby olympushunt » 03 22, 2017 •  [Post 31]

Roosiebull wrote:Oly, the ser razors are 1 1/4" cut


Thanks man...I figured they had a decent diameter....width or whatever ya want to call it. I think (as usual) I am overthinking this issue. If like Beendare is saying (which I totally agree) that with todays compounds penetration is probably sufficient with either head given a bow is tuned well and I am using a heavy arrow. So wouldn't I be better off with a 3 blade head Vs a 2??? More chance of a major vessel being cut? Granted that is has to be a small percentage better but I would like to have every advantage there. That being said, I have never heard of anybody shooting an elk with a 2 blade that wasn't very pleased with the outcome. Once again...it is that time of year where I need to get out scouting instead of playing on the computer hashing over things in my mind. lol
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby Beendare » 03 22, 2017 •  [Post 32]

olympushunt wrote:Beendare......penetration aside do you feel it is more important to get cutting diameter or tissue cut? I'm not sure I am explaining myself well...lol
?


I will take penetration and a razor sharp BH through the animal over wider cutting. There are some hair splitting reasons "why".....that I mentioned in my arrow thought thread.

We have been led to believe through advertising that a bigger hole or more cutting blades is better....I don't think it is "Better"

....but its true that with a modern compound just about everything works 95% of the time.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby scubohuntr » 05 01, 2017 •  [Post 33]

olympushunt wrote:Years ago do y'all remember those bheads that were like 5 blades? I think they were a cartridge on a ferule. Great for tissue severed I suppose but they didn't have a big diameter.

I shot some of those out of my first Oneida Eagle. Worst windplaning heads I ever shot, and that includes Razorheads and Ben Pearson Deadheads. Kinda weird, given the tiny diameter. I shoot Snuffers pretty much exclusively now. They are nothing like sharp out of the box, and I'm sure there are many better heads out there, but my bow shoots them pretty well, and I've never broken a blade on one. Not buying a bunch of new broadheads every year leaves me some budget for other stuff.
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Re: Sharpest out of the package fixed 3 blade BH?

Postby pointysticks » 05 02, 2017 •  [Post 34]

Snuffer SS.

if i didnt own about 20 montecs i would just buy the Snuffer SS. the ones i felt were sharper than the montecs.

i think what hurts some three blades is that the sharpening method is to simply lay two edges down on a flat surface and grind. you get a bigger cutting angle that way so they dont "feel" sharp. not scalpel sharp at least.

i tired using one of those tiny chainsaw files to put a steeper angle on a montec and i was a mess. it was difficult.
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