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Best Optics

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Best Optics

Postby Swede » 12 13, 2018 •  [Post 1]

I know I could place this on the equipment forum, but I want more of a campfire discussion. I am not asking for advise on what to buy or anything like that.
I suppose we have all read and heard, "buy the best optics you can afford". Is that always the best place to invest $2,000-$3,000 of your hard earned hunting dollars? When is good enough, good enough for binoculars, spotting scope, rifle scope and/or a range finder?
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Re: Best Optics

Postby DBLGBL » 12 14, 2018 •  [Post 2]

Good enough is when you are happy with what you have or have never looked through superior glass. 27 years ago I paid for high end glass that I still would not give up. I also think good enough depends on how much you use your glass.

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Re: Best Optics

Postby Lefty » 12 14, 2018 •  [Post 3]

Swede wrote:the best place to invest $2,000-$3,000 of your hard earned hunting dollars? ,,,,,,,
At first i thought you meant for each item,...
A decent scope makes my gun better.
Better quality binos can almost replace a spotting scope in hunting situations. My belief Spotting scopes are way over priced for what you get. I would however get a range finder with angle recalculation and magnification

To go cheap buy a name brand high production ( warranted) product. Or a reconditioned brand name
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Old school » 12 14, 2018 •  [Post 4]

I bought my Swarovski 10x42 SLC binos in the Cabelas bargain cave probably 15 years ago. I think they are worth the price - I paid somewhere around $1,000 for them. Just depends on the person I guess. At high noon, there's not much difference between the Swaro and the cheaper binos. In low light its a whole different story. I remember looking at some deer coming out into a field one evening just before end of legal shooting light. My dad was looking through his Nikons and saying "I think that's a buck that just came out" I said - yep, he's about a 140" 8 point. My dad shook his head - I handed him my Swaros and when he looked through them, he saw what I saw.

Do they make me a better hunter? Maybe.
Am I glad I have them? YES
If I didn't have them, would I fork over the cash for them now? Probably not as that's 1/2 the price of a DIY elk hunt for me and my boys.

--Mitch
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Indian Summer » 12 15, 2018 •  [Post 5]

If you don’t race you don’t need an expensive race car. But if you do and you like to win or at least place you need to invest in the proper tool for the job.

Win might be a bull of the standard you have set. Place would be any legal bull. If you are happy with any bull or you are cow hunting then you probably don’t need a spotting scope. If you spend a lot of time behind your binoculars then quality glass isn’t just about seeing the detail you need to see. It’s about seeing it in Low light... which is the most likely time to see game and it’s also about less eye fatigue. Fatigue can also lead to headaches which takes the fun right out of it.

Evaluate your needs. If you tree stand hunt you don’t have the same requirements as a mobile hunter. If you hunt timber you don’t have the same needs as an open country hunter. But in my opinion elk country is big and every elk hunter should have a decent pair of binos in the size they need. It’s an investment not an expense.
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Re: Best Optics

Postby saddlesore » 12 15, 2018 •  [Post 6]

Early in my hunting career,I used an $18 Bushnell Banner scope. It didn't even have self centering reticules. The biggest bull I have ever killed was a 7x 8 .That was using an old Weaver V-7 ( $50). This past year another big bull and that was using a Leoupold 2.5-8 (Probably a $500 scope) that some one had given me for taking them elk hunting and getting them a bull. Both were about the same distance, both were at first light.Both died about the same.

I do have a pair of Leupold binos that I paid about $300 for back in the early 80's.I still use them and I had bought them for a sheep and goat hunt I had.Biggest attribute when using them for a lot of glassing is they limit eye fatigue. These particular ones shave a focus adjustment on each eyepiece that I need. Lack of light gathering has never been a problem for me.I tend to not hunt late evenings and game I see in the AM is usually before legal shooting hours.
I tried a pair of those compact ones and could not get them focused.

I do have a Lieca range finder.Same guy that gave me the scope gave me it .They do come in handy hunting pronghorns out on the flat prairie, but sometimes hard to get a reading

These are my uses, others might need better glass
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Trumkin the Dwarf » 12 15, 2018 •  [Post 7]

I've had numerous times in the past few years where I look at a basin with my cheap 8x42's and wish for more magnification and/or a crisper image. The biggest revelation though came a few weeks back here in Texas.

I was hunting thick timber for hogs and saw a big whitetail buck at 30-40 yards through a thicket. I can't shoot deer in this spot, but his rack was big enough I wanted another look. Up came the binos, and to my great surprise, it was almost impossible to find that buck. Only the center of the lenses were actually clear, and at that range, I was eyeballing a 6-8 foot wide swath of trees. I don't notice that on the prairie, or glassing across canyons, but it makes a difference in the timber. You can bet I'm looking to upgrade binoculars now.

As for which one is best, that's not for me to say yet. I've done my research, but haven't actually tried some high end optics.
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Swede » 12 15, 2018 •  [Post 8]

Several years ago, I arrived at my pickup just as a fellow I knew drove up. We were both elk hunting, and since it was about noon we visited for a few minutes. He had a new pair of very expensive binoculars. I had a pair of Vortex Viper binos that I purchased from Elknut. I got to looking through his and could not tell the difference, but his cost $1,500 more than mine. This guy is really poor, but he had saved for many months and had the binoculars on layaway forever. I can't say he was wrong or his priorities were misguided. He has a lifetime investment with his purchase. I just had to wonder if he made the best decision.
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Old school » 12 15, 2018 •  [Post 9]

Swede wrote:Several years ago, I arrived at my pickup just as a fellow I knew drove up. We were both elk hunting, and since it was about noon


There's the key Swede - noon. Just like I stated in my post, I've not found much difference in broad daylight between the higher end binos and mid range ones. Try that same test with 5-10 minutes of shooting light left and its a whole different story.

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Re: Best Optics

Postby Elkhntr08 » 12 15, 2018 •  [Post 10]

I run Leupold pretty much across the board. I do have a Nikon Monarch on a .325 , and a Zeiss high end on a .338. I personally can’t tell any difference.
I’ve had great luck with Leupold and like the CS.
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Swede » 12 15, 2018 •  [Post 11]

Mitch, I agree with your point completely.
I have tried that test with equally priced binoculars. I have noticed a significant decrease in low light quality with a pair of Leopold binos. when measured against the similarly priced Vipers. The Vipers gathered a lot more light. I have never had two binos of equal power and lens size (i.e. 8X40 or 10X42), where one was significantly higher priced than the other.
Whereas I believe you completely, I have found that you can get about 98% of the quality of the high end binos at 30%-50% of the cost.
Young hunters trying to stretch every dollar and other people on a very limited budget can do well with just a few hundred dollars, but don't buy junk. Junk is never a good investment. Save until you can afford very good quality. You may have to look around a lot to get what you will be satisfied with, but poor quality is just frustrating in the long run.

Here is a rather funny story from experience: Shortly after buying the Vortex Vipers, I set up to check the clarity and distortion they had. I used the window that had white vertical and cross pieces as my target. I set up a bench at the edge of my garage and started looking about 100 yards at that window. Soon the older neighbor came over to visit. I had to explain that his window made a great target and I was not peering at him, but trying to measure the quality of my new glasses. Soon he was checking too, and all was well.

Elkhntr08, I like Leopold scopes and my binos are fine. They are good quality for the price. I am not as impressed with their binoculars as I am with their scopes.
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Re: Best Optics

Postby >>>---WW----> » 12 16, 2018 •  [Post 12]

This thread is sort of funny in a way. I suppose if I paid $2000+ bucks for something to hunt with, I'd swear up and down that they were the best there was, rather than admit that my buddy's cheaper set seemed to work just as well.

Case in point: I've never felt like paying big bucks for anything. Call me a cheap skate if you want. But my family is more important than hi priced hunting gear. Way back, many years ago, I met a fellow while hunting. I could tell he was well to do by all the fancy gear he had. He had a set of Swarovski hanging around his neck. So I ask him if I could take a look. So we swapped glasses and compared. He commented how impressed he was with mine. I told him I gave 750 for them. He said , "That's what I gave for mine"! To which I replied, "No, you don't understand, 7 dollars and 50 cents at a yard sale".
The look on his face was something I'll never forget. LOL!

I have no doubt that his Swaros probably were better for twilight conditions. But, that is usually past legal hunting times anyway, so who cares!!! By the way, I have upgraded since that time in the late 70's. But I have never even given the big three brands a second thought. Just goes to show there are good and bad in everything, including binoculars.

So if you are happy with what you have, regardless of price, that's all that matters. :D
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Indian Summer » 12 16, 2018 •  [Post 13]

It’s pretty funny how some of you guys can say the cheap stuff is just as good. At noon Swede.... really? One time I was looking at binos in Cabelas. High end stuff. I said to the guy can we take a walk outside so I can have a look in more realistic hunting conditions. His answer was no just look way down the aisle at some things further away. I told him I never see elk under fluorescent lighting. He said it’ll have to do. I handed them back and told him to have a nice day.

Yes your Cavalier will get you to Wal Mart and back. But not as fast or nearly as enjoyable as a Corvette.

Here’s my thought on the subject.... if you don’t appreciate truly good optics you probably just don’t have a use for them. You probably don’t spend much time using what you have. I use my binos all day every day in a wide range of conditions. When I use my spotting scope there’s a damn good reason for it. There are times when elk are little dots and I can’t even tell if there’s a bull with them. I’d pay $100 each time that happens to save 2 hours of my precious time and thousands of footsteps to hike over and find out.... if they are even there by the time I get there. Being able to watch a bull go to his bed in the first 15 minutes of the day is PRICELESS! It gives me a gameplan and can literally make or break my entire day... or year!

You can’t shoot what you can’t see. I’ve sat beside clients and glassed for a half an hour and had them say well.... nothing over there huh? and replied there are 22 mule deer and 17 elk over there. They were like What! :shock: Then they looked through my binos and said wow this ain’t whitetail hunting I guess. True story. Actually there were 2 clients. Can you see the elk in this picture? Lol neither could they.
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Re: Best Optics

Postby Swede » 12 16, 2018 •  [Post 14]

Joe, I think you misunderstood what I was saying. I have not advocated "cheap" binoculars. At least I do not consider the Vortex Viper binoculars "cheap". I am not promoting Vortex, but using them as an example of where you can get 98% of the usable quality of a much more expensive glass at a fraction of the cost. The cost difference between the glass I had, and the Swarovski EL 10X42 binoculars my friend had just purchased was at least $1,900. I have no objection to anyone buying whatever makes them happy. I am sure you got everything you paid for. My point is that there is great value in less expensive glass.
I had a great pair of Zeiss binoculars that I gave to my son when his binos were stolen from his pickup. I admit they were a real pleasure to look through, especially in the evening and I dark timber.

BTW: You could buy the binoculars from Cabelas and try them out. I don't blame them for not letting people take their equipment outside for a free test. He can't just abandon his work station and accommodate an inquisitive store visitor. Buy the binos and then take them back if you don't like them. They will give you a full refund, and your salesman can wait on other customers while you make up your mind.
Joe makes a good point for hunters that live in their optics. For them the extra cost is money well spent. In addition with excellent optics you will probably want to use them more. As a hunter that spends 90% of my hunting time in a tree, I am not using my binoculars the same as Joe does on his spot and stalk hunts.
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