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Bad Calling?

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Bad Calling?

Postby Trophyhill » 07 23, 2014 •  [Post 1]

I've heard guys say they made a cow call or a bugle and watched elk head for the next unit lickity split. So my question is simple. Can elk spot a phony when the calling is not the absolute best and most realistic it can be?
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby jmez » 07 23, 2014 •  [Post 2]

If the context is correct I say no. I think incorrect calling sends them packing as apposed to bad calling.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby twinkieman » 07 23, 2014 •  [Post 3]

IMO, no. I would have to believe wrong sound made is what made them get the hell out of dodge.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby Screaming_btf » 07 24, 2014 •  [Post 4]

I've heard ELK respond to some pretty bad sounding calls before, calls that I was frankly surprised didn't alert anything that overheard it to get out. So I don't think you need to sound 100% perfect and that the context and timing of the calls are much more critical. I believe that some ELK can tell a fake call however and you still need to sound reasonable well to get good constant responses.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby ishy » 07 24, 2014 •  [Post 5]

Tons of variables with this: does the bull relate the sound to previous bad experience that ended with being shot at or smelling a human, is sound from a trail or road that he has had run ins with said humans, do you sound great but sound just like a bull that kicked his tail...etc. Tough to pin it on good or bad calling, as elk make lots of bad calls.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby Lark Bunting » 07 24, 2014 •  [Post 6]

My fear this year is that I am going to go strolling into the woods and in my best impersonation of an elk be screaming to, RUN! THERE'S A T-REX COMING!!!
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby Swede » 07 24, 2014 •  [Post 7]

I have had elk respond positively to some pretty bad calls. It is more what is said than how it is said. I am not saying bad sounding calls are good, but you can often get away with them. Elk make some poor calls too. Consider a bull withy cows. He hears what he thinks is another bull that wants his cows. If he can just leave and keep his cows, will he come running up to you or just leave? Constant calling is similar. Often it alert the elk in the area that you are there. This is especially true if they have encounter hunters that way before.
You do not have to make perfect calls. Make respectable ones and know what to say, when. If in doubt, go with a sound that is nonthreatening.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby a3dhunter » 07 24, 2014 •  [Post 8]

yes,some elk can spot a phony.
Some elk will still come in to bad calling due to ignorance, inexperience, or being just plain stupid. (I like those bulls).
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby Trophyhill » 07 24, 2014 •  [Post 9]

Screaming_btf wrote:I've heard ELK respond to some pretty bad sounding calls before, calls that I was frankly surprised didn't alert anything that overheard it to get out. So I don't think you need to sound 100% perfect and that the context and timing of the calls are much more critical. I believe that some ELK can tell a fake call however and you still need to sound reasonable well to get good constant responses.


you hit on something here that a great elk killer in his own right and i have talked about. the short answer is yes an elk may respond to bad calling especially from longer distances. but as the distance closes between elk and hunter and the bad calling continues, chances are that elk is going to pick you out as a phony. i've been wrong before but my hunch is the closer you are the better your calling should be. especially when dealing with dominant bulls that are probably somewhat educated.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby foxvalley » 07 25, 2014 •  [Post 10]

I think some elk are "suprised" or shocked to here an elk(hunter) so close to them, after you sneak up and call,and their first thought is to run. Or you are saying something that makes no sense,or doesn't fit with what is really going on.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby Trophyhill » 07 25, 2014 •  [Post 11]

foxvalley wrote:I think some elk are "suprised" or shocked to here an elk(hunter) so close to them, after you sneak up and call,and their first thought is to run. Or you are saying something that makes no sense,or doesn't fit with what is really going on.


Could be but I had another experience a couple years ago on sept 4. I took a break to rehydrate and have a snack that morning when suddenly I heard a growl. I let out a challenge bugle with a couple grunts and I mean to tell you that herd bull came unglued! Yes he was surprised but did not run until.......the lead cow that I did not see barked and took off taking him with her! I was oh so close to killing a Gila Monster that morning. But I learned something from that.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby foxvalley » 07 25, 2014 •  [Post 12]

Cool.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby AZ Vince » 07 25, 2014 •  [Post 13]

In my not so humble opinion I think most folks call too much.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby CrazyElkHunter » 07 25, 2014 •  [Post 14]

Swede was right on. It's not how good or how bad, but what the sound said to the elk. I have heard some pretty bad elk calls, and some bulls that I thought were lousy hunters trying to call. Some of them sounded like a cat being run over. If your fortunate to run into a hot bull, just about any sound, good or bad is going to set him off. Timing and conditions change everything. If you hunt in a crowded unit like we do, most of the elk sounds we hear are hunters because elk are extremely bugle shy from all the pressure and are quiet. We are very fortunate to have people like Paul ( Elknut ) that are willing to share and explain all elk sounds because like humans, they have a language too. Learning what to say at the right time will increase your odds of success. Like Swede, I have been bowhunting elk for a very long time but I still learn something new every season just being in the woods with them. Several years ago I was moving through one of my favorite areas and I kept hearing the worst elk call I have ever heard. I started moving away from the hideous sound and decided to call this bad sounding hunter into a deep draw. This went on for over 45 min and he just wouldn't quit, so I decided to sit, call, and wait for him. Turned out to be a very nice 6x5. Felt like a total idiot. :oops:
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby mongopino915 » 07 26, 2014 •  [Post 15]

AZ Vince wrote:In my not so humble opinion I think most folks call too much.


Yep, especially in OTC heavily pressured public land where elk are sensitive to encountering human by the very nature of their language. Most average Joe callers think they have to call loud and often to make sure elk within the surrounding can/will hear them and they have to see elk or hear elk respond to know that elk are there. Must be because we learned to trust our senses of sight and hearing to be true.

Recognize the terrain, elk mood, and elk sign; slip in quietly, and at times, all it takes is one soft cow mew, raking a pine tree using a stick, or a low volume soft chuckle to bring that invisible and shy bull in quietly.

Yes, everyone would love to encounter hot and heavy non-stop bugling fests (like the kind you see in Primos), but it ain't Hollywood.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby Trophyhill » 07 26, 2014 •  [Post 16]

mongopino915 wrote:
AZ Vince wrote:In my not so humble opinion I think most folks call too much.


Yep, especially in OTC heavily pressured public land where elk are sensitive to encountering human by the very nature of their language. Most average Joe callers think they have to call loud and often to make sure elk within the surrounding can/will hear them and they have to see elk or hear elk respond to know that elk are there. Must be because we learned to trust our senses of sight and hearing to be true.

Recognize the terrain, elk mood, and elk sign; slip in quietly, and at times, all it takes is one soft cow mew, raking a pine tree using a stick, or a low volume soft chuckle to bring that invisible and shy bull in quietly.

Yes, everyone would love to encounter hot and heavy non-stop bugling fests (like the kind you see in Primos), but it ain't Hollywood.


I agree there are times to use soft calling and times to let it rip. As a good rule of thumb, it's easier to escalate your calling than it is to de escalate. De escalating an already charged situation with elk could be very difficult for success. Not saying it can't be done though.
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Re: Bad Calling?

Postby bowgy » 07 26, 2014 •  [Post 17]

I heard a hunter making really bad calls and when I snuck up on him to see which way he was headed so I could go the other way it turned out to be an elk!
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