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Dogging the herd, how to?

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Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby JGH » 06 22, 2013 •  [Post 1]

Last year, I woke up and heard a bull bugling about every 2 minutes, probably about 100-150 yards from camp.

It was still dark, but soon to be light. There was a bright moon, and no significant wind at all.

I thought he was calling in a little clearing I knew about that had good grass and a little water. I headed over there, keeping to the shadows.

When I got there, he was gone, but bugled again to the east, roughly on the same elevation, but back in thicker trees with deadfall. I followed, but I was nervous that I would bump into a herd of cows or something. He continued to bugle, and seemed to be heading southeast. I followed.

I committed a rookie mistake when I thought I was within about 75 yards and tried to cow call him back to me. He bugled "Get up here! Hurry up!" and so I then tried to sound like a smaller bull taking a cow away.

It didn't work. They were moving to a bedding area, I'm sure, and I think I should've dogged them a little longer, waited for them to bed, given them some time, and then tried to make a move on him.

Questions:

1. Am I right about what I should've done?

2. How do you follow a herd when all you have is their voluntary vocalizations to follow? I never had visual confirmation. I was worried about going either too fast (and bumping them) or too slowly (and losing them).

3. What would you do if you had a bull bugling like that near camp at night?
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby lang » 06 22, 2013 •  [Post 2]

Good post need some help hear too. I seem to always guess wrong about speed, to call or not, how far to push etc... If I slow down and be pt they are gone. When I push seem to bump the herd and still come up empty.
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby Lefty » 06 22, 2013 •  [Post 3]

Ive had the same happen. This is what I did and think I did it right :)
This what Ive done
If conditions seem right. get in front of them. Or wait till they bed and dont let them catch your wind.
While "patience is a virtue" it can backfire elk hunting
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby Swede » 06 22, 2013 •  [Post 4]

Last year the moon was bright at both ends of the season. You did not specify when this encounter took place. Also you did not say if the bull had cows. These are important details to consider. That said; it is also good to remember that every bull that bugles is not going to be easy to kill. Did you know where he was going to bed? It seems early in the morning. Was it especially hot?
Early season: If you had a way to get around him without being detected you could try an ambush. If the wind was in your favor, you might follow him to near his bedding area and try to appeal to his curiosity. Try a short small bull sound and rake a little then move a few yards and wait. The bull did tell you he was not coming to your cow call, so I would leave that alone and work with you bugle.
I believe this is one of the times where you can get too aggressive and give the bull an good education, if you are not careful. On the other hand, if you are wanting to someday kill a very smart bull, here is a good one to train.
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby JGH » 06 22, 2013 •  [Post 5]

Swede asked some more information.

It was toward the end of the season -- not Full Moon, but very bright that night.

I don't know if he had cows or not ... he sure seemed to be bugling a lot -- and grunting. I think, from the sounds of it, he was tending a small herd, but I don't know for sure. There had been another couple bulls bugling on the OTHER side of camp about 3 am, seeming to pester him, but they went silent, and he kept up.

Thanks for the replies so far ...
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby bnsafe » 06 23, 2013 •  [Post 6]

any other thoughts
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby ElkNut1 » 06 23, 2013 •  [Post 7]

At anytime when dogging this bull & then cow called in the 75yd range did you see this bull or any part of him? I ask because when you cow called & he bugled & chuckled you to come over his way you had him convinced you were a cow. Was it possible he re-positioned just enough to look into the area you called from & saw nothing or a slight movement from you? Many times this is all it takes is for him to have that slight suspicion somethings not right. That's a great spot for a decoy & go right at him when he calls you to him. Of course wind & cover must be in your favor for such an approach.

On another note, sometimes it's best not to call at all on a bull who is vocal enough where you can keep tabs on him & get position on him as to the direction he is traveling. Set an ambush & let him come to you. Just things to consider?

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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby JGH » 06 23, 2013 •  [Post 8]

I don't think he saw me, but maybe, as you said, he didn't see what he expected to see.

I followed him in the dark without calling for probably a couple hundred yards. As it became light, he went over a small hill, tall enough to hide me.

It was just getting to shooting light, and I thought this would make a great set-up ... a little knoll that he would have to come back across to see me.

I cow-called, then when he asked me to come see him, I tried to sound like a bull keeping the cow from coming to him, and hoped he would come back over the knoll to see who had interrupted his morning routine.

I never did see him, though I know he was coming because I heard him in the deadfall ... perhaps he did get to a point where he expected to see something and I just didn't recognize it.

If that was the case, I did better than I thought, and was closer to success than I pictured!

I'll try to ask another question -- When dogging the herd, how do you decide to stay quiet and follow, versus trying to interrupt their travel with a challenge? (Ambush/getting in front of them wasn't possible due to terrain issues.)
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby welka » 06 23, 2013 •  [Post 9]

If I have a bull bugling that much and I am confident in the direction he is moving, I try to follow silently. Bugling at him until you are SURE you are inside the 75 yard range likely results in him rounding up his harem and moving away. Cow calling might make him ponder, but you also alert all the eyes of the herd (see sentry cow). Its rare when you get one bugling multiple times, so as long as you have the wind or can get ahead, follow silently. Only call when you are sure you are within 100 yards (light cow call and be ready to jump on his bugle if he calls you over) or if he goes quiet. Good job getting close.
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Re: Dogging the herd, how to?

Postby Vanish » 06 24, 2013 •  [Post 10]

This is a situation I am interested in, as well. Every time I have been in this situation, I've had to RUN to keep up, and elk lungs are stronger than mine. :D Hard to do that silently, too! I think part of the problem is, where I am hunting there isn't a whole lot of nature to guide their path ... no way to guess where they are headed based on terrain.
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