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Where did all the elk go?

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Where did all the elk go?

Postby lilshootergirl » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 1]

I spent all year scouting on the ground, Google earth and talking to people about the elk in the area, I and several others couldn't find elk! Gone! A few of us hiked 5 miles from roads, and trails! Nothing! There was no snow up high, clear cut burning going on, seen huge Deer, moose! But no elk! I pushed my self beyond my physical condition, still no elk?? Am I missing something?
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 2]

You have a few days left to buy a point in Wyoming. Buy it! You’ll do way better finding elk on your own. Or if you want a solid plan that comes from actual on the ground experience perhaps you should consider one of my Do It Yourself elk hunting plans.

www.headinwest.net

I guarantee you will be into elk.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Jhg » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 3]

lilshootergirl wrote:... Am I missing something?


No, you are doing it right.

Sometimes they just decide to frequent another area. Now you have a solid knowledge of an area. Next summer add another area to this one. Over time, you will have several areas under your belt that you can tap when one or another does not hold elk.
Keep at it.
One day it will just click as you are scouting and you will begin to really maximize your time and efforts and finding elk will become easier and easier because you just "know" where they like to be in a given type place.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Jhg » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 4]

Indian Summer wrote:...You’ll do way better finding elk on your own.
...


X2 on that!
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 5]

I’m bummed you didn’t have a better hunt though. I know you worked hard and had high hopes. I had a good feeling you’d do better.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Jhg » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 6]

Another thought on self-doubt: I was in the same place as you coming from an eastern whitetail backround. Elking it was sooo different than whitetailing it. I was always second guessing my choices. One hunt day I was thinking about how I was always getting on deer, but elk only sometimes. It dawned on me I got on elk AND deer. I realized I got on elk when they werr there. If I did not get on elk it was not because of me. They just were not there. Big difference!! I was able to hunt much more effectively knowing what I was doing was sound woodsmanship. Hope that helps.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby ElkNut1 » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 7]

If unable to scout previous to your hunt (opening day) you need to cover some serious ground & do tons of glassing! If you were aware of escape routes in your area they too can prove to be effective elk getters!

Now it's mid season, hunt where there's been little to no pressure & where elk should be. Snow or no snow will dictate the areas.

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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Swede » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 8]

lilshootergirl wrote: I and several others couldn't find elk! Gone! A few of us hiked 5 miles from roads, and trails! Nothing!


I have a theory on that. The State game officials take all the elk in the day before the season opens. They can tantalize you with the same ones year after year. We often have the same situation in Oregon. If I were you I would write to the Idaho Department of Fish and Wildlife and complain.
BTW: After buying a cup of chowder for lunch, I am convinced that restaurants are doing essentially the same thing. I think they have one clam in the kitchen they dunk every week to give it a bath. After removing the clam, they throw in some spuds and cream of something and call it "Clam Chowder". Maybe I should start writing too. :D
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby lilshootergirl » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 9]

I looked for crossings, played the thermals & wind..I got 5 photos of the biggest Mulley! Huge! I could have shot him at 20ft with my 38! No tag! But he couldn't figure out what I was, no UV, full camo. I really appreciate everyone's input, Wyoming here I come, i'd love to get antelope too! So when do you draw for 2019? I know others had better luck there!. Another thing my rifle is so heavy, looking for a lighter one, but in 308! Love the 308! Ill try to post that Mulley photo! Also ran into a wolf 5.3 miles in, he left in a seconds. Don't get me wrong I love the hunt part, but when years pass and no meat it really wears on you, what can I do to increase my chances, I hike like a goat and silent too! But just need to learn to find those stinky elk! Yea! I smell them way before I see them, it was so thick where I was, bet i'd do better with less
Trees. Anyway thank you for pointing me in the right way, your all so kind!
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Swede » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 10]

Shooter, I have a Kimber Montana in 308W that I have been planning to sell. It has had about 20 shots through it. It has a 4X Leupold scope. Very light. If you are interested it is yours for $1,000. There is a very small chip on the side of the synthetic stock. The chip was glued back on, but it is a little visible. I will post a picture if you are interested.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Jhg » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 11]

Like I said, if you are getting on big mulies then you'd be into elk too. If they were there. Your doing it right. The fact you can get close to a mule deer buck tells me that. Those guys are no easy prey.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 10 26, 2018 •  [Post 12]

“It was so thick where I hunted”

If you are bow hunting that’s ok. But if you are gun hunting move on to greener pastures! Even if you do find elk odds are they are going to see you first. Jump shooting elk in timber is not a high percentage game. Another reason to hit Wyoming. My partners and I see elk every day. That doesn’t mean we have shot opportunities but seeing elk and plenty of bulls sure does motivate you to get up early and hunt hard. If my gun didn’t misfire last year we would have went 3 for 3 on bulls and for the other two guys it was their first bull so it’s not like you can’t accomplish what they did.

Locating elk is the name of the game and I love lots and lots of meadows, aspen stands where the lay of the land allows you to glass them up before you wear yourself down.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby lilshootergirl » 10 28, 2018 •  [Post 13]

Yes, it was thick! I did see a single large bull tracks, so maybe he's bedded near by! I'm always getting close, but not to elk. I'm going to work on Wyoming, i've always wanted to hunt antelope! Hard to glass when there bedded and the timber is thick, heard the wolves are thick, everyday is see huge slot tracks, seen one for a second the snetches let me know they were there before I spotted them above me. Well if I can drive a trail trailer 576 miles, I guess I can drive further(by myself) oh, on the 11th. I was 14 miles west of missoula, a guy driving 80 hit 6 elk!! 2 others stopped, I had 3 flash lights one flasher on the black car sitting between the lines, 2 semi truck were hitting that grade fast, I was amazed at the last minute them swerved just missing this guys car! Scary! I was driving 55 as dusk, few minutes earlier it would have been me! Someone was looking over me! So no night driving for me! Another thing no road kills on 93, while I was there? Surprising. Well I'm researching Wyoming, as I thick January is the time to put in.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Lefty » 10 28, 2018 •  [Post 14]

During archery season we were in the elk nearly every day, mostly in the thick and nasty.
I have a rifle elk tag, the two days I was up the elk were ghosts. But thats what happens with a bit of pressure and a series of elk seasons.

My suggestion on antelope If you dont need a big Wyoming antelope. Put in applications in high draw with lots of public land.
Our most family fun hunts use-to be, Wyoming over-the-counter doe tags
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 10 29, 2018 •  [Post 15]

Wyoming antelope is a fun hunt. No need to get up early, no mountains to climb, no timber. Wyoming elk applications have to be in by the end of January. If you don’t draw they put your app into the random draw which isn’t based on points so there’s always a chance of getting a tag even with zero points. Go kill an antelope and stop to check out your elk area. As far as nocturnal elk go.... they still leave tracks. If there’s not a good amount of sign it’s time to move on.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby elkstalker » 10 29, 2018 •  [Post 16]

Elk hunting in fair weather is hard! And a lot can happen between the summer patterns elk run and the post-rut patters they develop. When I first started hunting Idaho's general seasons I always was there the first week of the season, and always had a hard time finding elk. My boss gave me some good advice, and that's to hunt as late as possible or when weather comes in. When it's warm and sunny (and this past week when the moon was out bright all night) elk have it easy, and don't have much to move them around or keep them out during the daylight hours. That can make for some tough frustrating hunting.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby lilshootergirl » 10 29, 2018 •  [Post 17]

Elkstalker, the moon was full!! My 1st mistake is listening to random people on how everyone gets a elk! Yea right! 2nd no snow, it was up to 70s to 60s very little tracks. That area as far as hiking was rough & loud, I couldn't move without some sort of noise, then about 12 the wind would do a 360, even on the north face thermals moved early. I've learned a lot. Later would be better. Thanks everyone, not sure what I'll do next year as my points are at the point to be drawn in areas I know!
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 10 29, 2018 •  [Post 18]

Very true elkstalker. If I had to pick 2 of the 5 weeks to hunt gun season in Montana it would be the first and last. But I’d only go with the first if I knew where the elk were. Otherwise I’ll take Thanksgiving week for sure. I’ve killed lots of elk that week. Climb as high as you can until the snow is to your knees and everyone else is below you and elk will be concentrated up there. It still pays to know something about traditional staging areas.... places where elk stack up until the season is over and they drop all the way down, but it’s no longer a game of where’s the needle in the haystack. Also when there are 4 to 6 or more bulls in a herd the odds of seeing a bull and getting a shot are better. I love late season elk hunting!!!
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby lilshootergirl » 11 03, 2018 •  [Post 19]

I wonder if next season will be as hot? Not sure even alamec can tell us? I seen lots of wolf tracks wonder if that played in with the smoke, and the elk were unable to use there noses, so they moved out? I'm going to further my research to see where it takes me! One thing I know for sure I won't give up! Thanks guys you gave me a lot to think about, and research to go on!
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Lsb » 11 03, 2018 •  [Post 20]

Indian Summer wrote:Very true elkstalker. If I had to pick 2 of the 5 weeks to hunt gun season in Montana it would be the first and last. But I’d only go with the first if I knew where the elk were. Otherwise I’ll take Thanksgiving week for sure. I’ve killed lots of elk that week. Climb as high as you can until the snow is to your knees and everyone else is below you and elk will be concentrated up there. It still pays to know something about traditional staging areas.... places where elk stack up until the season is over and they drop all the way down, but it’s no longer a game of where’s the needle in the haystack. Also when there are 4 to 6 or more bulls in a herd the odds of seeing a bull and getting a shot are better. I love late season elk hunting!!!

Around here they head down when the snow hits. Tromp around all you want in knee deep snow, they are down on private.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 11 04, 2018 •  [Post 21]

Lsb wrote:
Indian Summer wrote:Very true elkstalker. If I had to pick 2 of the 5 weeks to hunt gun season in Montana it would be the first and last. But I’d only go with the first if I knew where the elk were. Otherwise I’ll take Thanksgiving week for sure. I’ve killed lots of elk that week. Climb as high as you can until the snow is to your knees and everyone else is below you and elk will be concentrated up there. It still pays to know something about traditional staging areas.... places where elk stack up until the season is over and they drop all the way down, but it’s no longer a game of where’s the needle in the haystack. Also when there are 4 to 6 or more bulls in a herd the odds of seeing a bull and getting a shot are better. I love late season elk hunting!!!

Around here they head down when the snow hits. Tromp around all you want in knee deep snow, they are down on private.


I know places like that too. Further north of where she hunted.... up in the Bitterroot the CB Ranch is about 6000 acres where elk run to early. But anything south of that there’s really no private large enough to be a refuge. Elk stay as high as they can. More than half the years the snow doesn’t get more than 8 or 10 inches deep by Thanksgiving which is the end of the season. To an elk that doesn’t like lead poisoning that much snow is nothing. They have migration routes that they use every year. Along those routes are places they will hold up on until digging for food requires too much work. Those places are elk gold mines! There are elk that go there by habit too even if the snow doesn’t force them. The bull in the “Happy Camper” thread was killed in the best and most consistent staging area I know. I’ve known of 8 or more bulls being killed there in a single season. There elk that will be there tomorrow have no idea what happened there today. I love that. I’ve killed my share of bulls in that same spot. One year I was seriously worried about getting my elk out. The snow was 6 inches above my knees when we came back the next day for it. When those elk do go to wintering ground it’s just low elevation south facing slopes that are public land. I’ve killed them there too but never anything big. The big boys are toughing it out up in the hills until the guns are back in the cabinets. None of those elk spend any amount of time on private land.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby saddlesore » 11 04, 2018 •  [Post 22]

Elk move around too. It has been my experience that they tend yo travel in large circles coming back to certain feeding areas every few weeks to a month unless hunting pressure affects them.. A lot of people go into an area and if they don't see elk right now they figure there isn't any ,but the elk may appear in another day or another week. A person can't tell. I don't go for the tactic of putting 10-15 miles on your boots every day looking for elk. It's pretty obvious to me that if elk are on the move and you are on the move, your chance of meeting are pretty slim in a 100,000 acre area.

Hunting migration routes here in Colorado is a shot of luck.Your success depends on the weather. Some years that migration happens in the3rd season, sometimes the fourth, sometimes after elk season is over.If you hunt draw areas , and it doesn't happen in your season,you are SOL. Even OTC tags are iffy.

Of course a person needs to know what type of habitat hold elk and when they tend to be in that area. You don't gain that knowledge in 1-2 hunting seasons
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 11 04, 2018 •  [Post 23]

saddlesore wrote:Elk move around too. It has been my experience that they tend yo travel in large circles coming back to certain feeding areas every few weeks to a month unless hunting pressure affects them.. A lot of people go into an area and if they don't see elk right now they figure there isn't any ,but the elk may appear in another day or another week. A person can't tell. I don't go for the tactic of putting 10-15 miles on your boots every day looking for elk. It's pretty obvious to me that if elk are on the move and you are on the move, your chance of meeting are pretty slim in a 100,000 acre area


If you put on that many miles and didn’t find elk something is very wrong. Either the habitat just is adequate or you don’t know where to look. Covering miles along a ridge top trail is easy. But it’s not the elk zone.

As far as elk moving around: Absolutely. But just as the the elk that are here today can be gone tomorrow, the ones that aren’t here today could be here by morning. So if I know I’m in good elk country I think there should always be elk somewhere in about 4 square miles.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby saddlesore » 11 04, 2018 •  [Post 24]

Indian Summer wrote:As far as elk moving around: Absolutely. But just as the the elk that are here today can be gone tomorrow, the ones that aren’t here today could be here by morning. So if I know I’m in good elk country I think there should always be elk somewhere in about 4 square miles.


Which is why I posted " Of course a person needs to know what type of habitat hold elk and when they tend to be in that area. You don't gain that knowledge in 1-2 hunting seasons

Yep.I have two areas that I have hunted elk for years.One ,I have killed four elk ( 3 bulls and a cow) from within 50 yards of a shooting position with a center fire rifle. Another within 100yards, I have killed five elk,mostly cows with my muzzle loader.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Magic » 11 04, 2018 •  [Post 25]

Some areas in Colorado experienced a serious drought this Summer, so there was very little grass. I communicated with the local Wildlife Officer in the unit where I hunted last year and he told me that the Elk had already moved down to the Wintering Grounds during the second season. The two areas where I did hunt I found the same situation. When I left one unit there were ~90 head of Elk with three large bulls out on the Winter Grounds. We moved South 90 miles to another unit where I had previously hunted and found the same situation. The Elk were not on the mountain but had migrated to the private ranch East of the National Forest.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 11 05, 2018 •  [Post 26]

Yeah.... I don’t really care for hunting elk where there are big sections of private land. I hunted Wyoming unit 34 one year on private. I killed a nice 6 point bull so I was happy. But even the ranch I was on was really tough because for some reason all the elk were on the ranches north and south of me. Where I regularly hunt the wintering grounds are public and you can hunt there so the elk darn sure don’t show up early. The big mountains on the west sides of Montana and Wyoming are home to me. It’s fair chase at it’s finest. If you are willing to work you can always find elk to hunt and kill. No looking over a fence and dreaming. That’s really frustrating.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby saddlesore » 11 05, 2018 •  [Post 27]

That is one big problem in Colorado.There are very few places that a person can go in past 6-7 miles where you don't greet people/hunters coming in from the opposite side.

Very few major drainages are public land. When the areas were homesteaded, people knew if they controlled the bottom lands ( valleys) they would eventually control access to the surrounding countryside.There is a lot of public land land locked by private land and the areas that are not, suffer the same problem of the elk running to the private land after the first rifle shot.
One area I hunt ,it is not uncommon for 400-600 head of elk to be seen down on the valley floor on privateland during the1st rifle season
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby lilshootergirl » 11 06, 2018 •  [Post 28]

I know of some ranches in the lower units, ill call and ask them if the elk move down? Maybe I can get permission? I hope so, love that area, but if I can't see any elk, I'm not wasting any more $$$ or time! I'm not getting any younger. If not its back to researching. I heard hunting was hard this year, elk gone! Hopefully fish & game can give me some on-site on what's going on. Thank you it's giving me more to think about. And knowledge. I am looking at a film a rifle, mine really thru my balance off wholesaling so step areas!
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 29]

Never know but if there is a ranch big enough to hold elk, especially bulls, someone is hunting or outfitting there. Door knocking for elk is like asking the girl in the convenience store to sell you the winning lottery ticket. If you are so set on the particular area get a Montana license and move slightly north over the border. Still not Wyoming but it sounds like you love the area.... for some reason. If I pound an area hard and never see an elk I fall out of love with it real fast. Life is to short to look for needles in haystacks.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Tigger » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 30]

something that Indian Summer said should really resonate with elk hunters. He said, "running ridgetops is easy, but that is not the elk zone". Did you catch that? There is a lot of wisdom in that statement. It begs the question, "then what is the elk zone"? Do you know where the elk zone is on a mountain? Do you know where elk tend to be in a drainage? Where is hunting pressure coming from? When elk feel pressured, where do they go and how do they get there? Answer those questions correctly and you will find elk. If you don't answer them correctly, you wont find elk! Hope that helps.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Swede » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 31]

Saying elk are not on the ridges is like opening Pandora's box. Let's look in on another thread.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 32]

Swede wrote:Saying elk are not on the ridges is like opening Pandora's box. Let's look in on another thread.


The key word wasn’t ridges Swede.... it was ridge TOPS. They sure aren’t standing around along ridge top trails feeding and bedding. Not hanging out along creek bottom pack trails either. They are somewhere in between on mid slope benches where steep hills and the thought of back packing horse sized animals keeps a good percentage of people from even wanting to kill them there.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby elkstalker » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 33]

lilshootergirl wrote:I know of some ranches in the lower units, ill call and ask them if the elk move down? Maybe I can get permission?

LSG, there are definitely elk using the general area you were in, but they can be very fluid. There are elk that use private land lower in the drainage, and in December and January you can count hundreds of them right along the main roads. I firmly believe that you just had a bad week with previous hunting pressure and weather, try not to be too discouraged.

One thing I have learned, if they aren't there, move... head to a different drainage. The drainage I hunted first week this year, held over 200 elk when I hunted it with my daughter 3 years ago. I only spotted 2 cows there the first week of the season this year, and only a few more the next week. We got over a foot of snow up higher and boom, a herd of about 20 showed up, and I killed my bull. In the meantime I was searching elsewhere, tried plans B thru D. Keep moving if the elk aren't there, but know they can show back up too. For the location I was hunting all it took was the snow up high to get them moving. Other times it takes hunters pushing the elk around. Sometimes when you only have a week to hunt you just need to push into the areas that haven't been hunted yet. Elk are very reactive. They prefer certain areas (for feed, cover, water), but if pressured hard enough they head out. They continue to move until they find a place where there is no/less pressure, or they turn nocturnal and you'll never see them in the open until weather forces them to feed out longer. The one major benefit of sticking it out in one area is that you accumulate knowledge of where all these locations are, sometimes it takes multiple years to figure it out.
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Swede » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 34]

Ridge noun 1. Raised Strip A long narrow raised area of something 2. Raised Land Formation A long narrow hilltop or range of hills. And let me add #3. A place where Swede sets tree Stands in the saddle to ambush elk. :D
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Indian Summer » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 35]

Saddle: Noun A place where elk pass through briefly on their way to the places where they spend more time. Haha :lol:
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby WapitiTalk1 » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 36]

Indian Summer wrote:Saddle: Noun, A place where elk pass through briefly on their way to the places where they spend more time. Haha :lol:


True that mister :D. Slight variation is: Saddle w/natural mineral lick; Noun; A place elk will hang out a bit longer than on a normal saddle, just long enough to lure a hunter across a mile wide canyon to ultimately realize that they're just as gone as if it were a non-mineral lick saddle ;)
Saddle MIN Lick.png
Saddle MIN Lick.png (1.06 MiB) Viewed 8907 times
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Re: Where did all the elk go?

Postby Swede » 11 07, 2018 •  [Post 37]

People that hunt ridges usually find ridges. People that hunt elk will go where the elk go. I agree with I.S. to a point. Get off the ridges to locate elk. I can show you elk rubs, elk trails, elk beds on ridge tops, but more often the elk don't hang out there. I think that was Joe's point. Elk are often pushed off ridges because hunters like them to call from, or because they are easier to travel on than the mountain side.
BTW: The location in RJ's photo would have been my first choice to place a stand, when I went hunting with him in Idaho, except I was reluctant to try and pack one out of there. I wish I had just made that commitment and gone in. Instead I got a small bull on another side ridge a lot closer to the road.
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