explain simple things to me

[bnsafe]

ok, what exactly is a trail head. where and how do you find them. how far to you follow them.
how do you find roads into the back country away from others.
i have been hiking a little here in colorado and there are alot of "trailheads" off hwy 14 for example, but they are where everybody and their dog goes to hike. i cant imagine an elk being within 5 miles of there. surely these areas arnt what you guys are talking about.

[mtnmutt]

For my hunting areas, my "trailheads" happen to be abandon/closed/blocked old 4x4 trails. These are common for national forest near a wilderness or in a wilderness area.

The National Forest appears to close 4x4 trails due to excessive damage or if the wildlife is believed to disturbed by the motorized traffic, especially if it is a calving area.

3 years ago, they used a front loader to tear up a trail that was never meant for or designated for motorized traffic. I hunted down that trail and had my first shot on an elk there, but by 9 am the atvs and motorbikes were zooming down this non motorized trail.

Unfortunately, the National Forest wisdom was to do this front loader/bulldozer work the 1st week of the season, so there were no elk in there that year. However, now it is great because there is no more motorized traffic where there are elk and it is a quick 30 minute trek.

[cnelk]

Scott
You need to get further from FC.
Get away from those Subaru parking lots next to the road.

[bnsafe]

how did you know those were all subarus. lol. i will when the weather warms a little and i get settled into work. looking forward to going to the nat forest and just throwing a tent out for a weekend. im just trying to figure out what to look for when im scouting. we dont have trailheads in mo and there were none where i elk hunted last year. i am sure i drove by a few on a drive we took but they all had a car parked in them, and certainly didnt stand out. i will keep looking. thanks

[Swede]

As stated earlier "trailheads" are points you can drive to so you can access the trail. Trails are developed to provide easier access into different remote areas. Mostly they are for Subaru owners, who wear shorts, tennis shoes and a Swiss Mountaineer hat, and go yodeling out through the forest. When there are not enough of the yodelers, the Forest Service uses archery elk hunters with their diaphragms and grunt tubes. In either case, trailheads and the trails they access are a great place to congregate lots of people.

[Lefty]

,...., who wear shorts, tennis shoes and a Swiss Mountaineer hat, and go yodeling out through the forest. When there are not enough of the yodelers, the Forest Service uses archery elk hunters with their diaphragms and grunt tubes. ,......

Kind of struck me a bit funny Thanks Swede

[sreekers]

Made me laugh too. Most of mine have 4wd trucks there. Subarus haven't invaded Wyoming yet...

[Indian Summer]

I guess it depends on where you are. I hear stories of trailheads that are like Wal mart parking lots.

I've stood at trailheads loading mules watching bulls bugle back and forth. I've also killed elk where I could see the truck. I'm talking about official Forest Service trailhead with sign boards and steel hitch rails where the road is gated and goes on past that. We kill bulls close to there all the time. Some on the gated road. Sometimes you don't see much on them but if you walk 100 yards off them it's a whole other world. The bull in my avatar was killed 45 minutes from the truck in Wyoming and there were other bulls bugling all around. I'm glad I don't hunt those Wal Mart states.

[easeup]

thanks for the honest question.....one that I never can recall seeing on a hunting forum.
from the posts above me I must assume they must not all be places a bowhunter wants to be. I will try to explain too.
I use the natl forest of your choice travel map....they are large fold out maps with 1mile grids that show trails roads, mountains, streams and so forth.
the trail head is the intersection of a trail with a access road. you can see on the map where the trail goes to check its length and how to get to it. then go the GE to see how the terrain looks or use a topo map.
Many of the NF websites will have them for sale. also the NF website may provide you information as to which if any of those trails are popular with the suburu crowd. you can plan accordingly. I have spent a lifetime using the THs for access into some of Gods finest country. some were fishing trips, some backpacker hunts, some were the 8 horse cowboy packins. I guess I must know how to stay away from the dayhikers, mushroom pickers and family dogs, because I have yet to run into a clan such as them yet. Most of them in CO too.

I have always said the city types pick the popular destinations; meaning there is some famous mountain on the trail or some other merit badge they get for doing that trail. So we dont do those type destinations. but normally if you pick a trail that does not have a paved access point, doea not have a named mountain at its terminal point, or some calender photo spot along the way, you are good to go.

[bnsafe]

thanks guys. i hate to ask dumb questions but i hear yall talking about a th or something else that you have been doing your whole life and im like, what the heck is that and how do you find it. thanks again men. this was actually a real question and not just trying to catch dotman,

[cnelk]

Scott
Just send you a PM.
Lots of simple things in that info for you...

Brad

[bnsafe]

got it. thank you. AGAIN, I WANT TO THANK YOU GUYS FOR TAKING A FLATLANDER AND MAKING HIM FEEL WELCOME AND HELPING, EVEN WITH STUFF THAT IS SIMPLE THAT YALL HAVE DONE WITHOUT EVEN THINKING ABOUT IT.

[>>>---WW---->]

Don't want to sound like a smarty pants, BUT! Welcome to the front range, land of hockey moms and pasture pool (aka: golf) dads. The best way to get away from the bulk of them is to bush wack.

But as you have already found out, trailheads are a great place to find out how many people are using the area.

[bnsafe]

oh i was painfully aware what the frontrange was before we moved. matter of fact my wife had a couple job offers on the western slope and down south. but, she is more of a big city girl and this made her happy. plus im still 14 hours closer to elk than i was. and the tags are cheaper

[bowhunterty]

Trailheads can also be that curve in a road that allows you to access your honey hole. Or a turn off on a dirt road with room to park a couple trucks with a berry picker trail that leads to a basin.

[JGH]

As a wise friend once told me, "If Momma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy."

Be happy that she is happy and you are (relatively) happy, too!

[WapitiTalk1]

ok, what exactly is a trail head. where and how do you find them. how far to you follow them.
how do you find roads into the back country away from others.
i have been hiking a little here in colorado and there are alot of "trailheads" off hwy 14 for example, but they are where everybody and their dog goes to hike. i cant imagine an elk being within 5 miles of there. surely these areas arnt what you guys are talking about.

Trailheads are great parking spots/starting points that start one off on a cleared path (many times maintained) that may spearhead deep into a wilderness or non wilderness area, aka, an area well away from roads and a significant portion of hunter pressure. You don't have to hunt "on" the trail or near it (although many a wapiti have been taken close to trails for sure) but you may certainly use the trail as a strategic access route to get you deep into the elk woods. Case and point... There's one trail system I use that circumnavigates many, many square miles of an elk area. I don't necessarily hunt from the trail, or, even camp close to the trail but this trail system gets me into where I want to go a hell of a lot quicker than just busting up the side of a mountain. Lots of good information on this thread but in my meager opinion, don't discount main FS trails to get you deep into the elk woods. Another tool for a hunter's kit bag is to casually peer into the rigs parked at the trailhead. If you see Birkenstocks on the floorboard, or, "How to Identify Native Flora" literature, in five out of the six Outbacks parked there (sorry, another Subaru reference), you probably won't have much to worry about in the way of hunters if this is the only access route to where your target hunting area is. If you see spare hunting boots, coolers, Elknut's playbook on the dashboard (shouldn't have forgotten that), and camo clothing strewn throughout the vehicles in a majority of the vehicles, well... it may not be the best place to access where you want to hunt.

[bnsafe]

more great info.

[horseshoe]

Let me add this.....I am also a newbie, even though I have been out to Colorado twice now. Although many don't like the crowds, TRAILHEADS are also a place to meet some very friendly and helpful fellow hunters! Our first hunt we were even tipped off to elk sightings up on the mtn from the trailhead. This tip let to our first successful calling set-up! Didn't score, but what a rush! Thanks to all!

[Swede]

I have been hunting more than a 55 years and been around hunters all of my life. I have heard that kind of "information" many times. My advise is to ignore all trailhead tales about where the animals are. I know there is a pearl in there every once in awhile, from a person who isn't going back and doesn't care, but generally the information you get is garbage. It is normally so useless that I never ask, and if it is offered anyway, I ignore it and just go about my own hunt.
You can and will get good information on this forum, but we don't see posts offering specifics on anyone's honey hole. Be skeptical if anyone sends you back where they just hunted. They ain't lookin back, cus they ain't goin back.

[cnelk]

Swede speaks wise words...

If you were to see me at the trailhead and I had blood on my hands, my answer to the question 'Ya see anything?' would be the standard...
Nope.

But I have learned to wash my hands to not risk anyone seeing the blood too

[horseshoe]

Ya, I hear you Swede & you too cnelk. I too have been hunting a very long time and have learned of what you speak. I never ask for spots and always take info too easily given with a grain of salt and always look for clues. But, on the other hand, a lot of folks seem always willing to help you figure out things yourself. Being entirely new to elk hunting, we relish any info or suggestions.

In the instance I mentioned previously, an already successful hunter told us that some car campers had come by and mentioned that they had glassed some elk near the top of the mountain above camp. Seeing as my buddy was temporarily out of commission due to some nasty blisters, we decided to drive up the road a bit and do some road glassing ourselves. Go figure, as soon as we parked I could see an elk up on the mtn, thru up the glasses and could see it was a bull, and a decent one at that! Couldn't argued about info like that! The rest was a blast!

So far, I still have no problems jumping off at the trailheads as we seem to get away from most others up on the mountain, but we like the camaraderie of a trailhead when we get back down.

[Da White Shoe]

Swede speaks wise words...

If you were to see me at the trailhead and I had blood on my hands, my answer to the question 'Ya see anything?' would be the standard...
Nope.

But I have learned to wash my hands to not risk anyone seeing the blood too

Yeah, we pack every elk we kill into the main camp in total darkness... for just that reason!

Phantom has a very good point... it's faster to use the maintained trails to get back in a good ways.
Then, use the lesser trails to get away from that main trail.
Use a ridge, creek or a valley to get away from the lesser trail.
In the end, there shouldn't be any trail at all.

[easeup]

this post is not to disagree at all.
However, experience can differ. so I want to brag( for loss of a different word) that most of my fellow hunters from the Lone Star state will openly speak to help you.
same as many strangers on this forum share what they know to help others. In fact I drew a tag in NM a couple years back, in a unit I had never seen nor knew jackxxx about. A stranger on AT gave me a couple of tips so that the day I parked at the trailhead by myself, I did not feel lost at all( site unseen).
and by the grace of God and his willingness to help me, there is a beautiful 300 class bull on my wall.

so this thread my steer off to the one a few weeks back about sharing hunting secrets....

[bnsafe]

i would never expect anybody to give me their hunting spot location. wouldnt even ask. i try to be very general on here so as to not get anybody upset that im asking what trailhead they use. by the same token, i would not lie to fellow hunters about seeing elk or not. i may not tell them, but i would never tell em i saw something when i didnt. as much as i would love to have my own spot that nobody has ever been to before those spots are gone. theres nowhere im gonna go thats not somebodies spot. i dont mean to encroach, but just wanna hunt. if i was more of a people person maybe i would make friends at a trailhead and get some help gettin my elk out.

[Da White Shoe]

I've seen some very good areas that were completely ruined because the word got out.
One year we're alone at the trailhead... and then, one weekend warrior sees you haul out a bull.
The next year it gets crowded and the year after that.... you can't find a place to camp.
No sense in doing something that will draw a crowd.

That said, one year we had a young guy come into our main camp... just to BS and have a beer.
It was easy to see that he was a good guy and we liked him right away... he was just inexperienced with bowhunting elk.
We ended up taking him with us for the remainder of that hunt... even gave him a horse to ride. No one killed anything, but it was fun.
Well, 2012 was the 14th year in a row that we've hunted together now.
In that time, he's killed 3 very nice bulls with us... two of 'em were bigger than anything I've ever killed!
Not sure I like him so much now....

[Da White Shoe]

Delete double post

[bnsafe]

sounds like a lucky guy.

[Swede]

Da white shoe: Good story and great post.

[Da White Shoe]

sounds like a lucky guy.

I will admit, that first year was frustrating to some degree... he couldn't even make a cow call, let alone a bugle.
What do you do with the guy that can't call elk? No choice. You put them out front as a shooter!
Hunting partners that don't call are soon looked upon... kind of like your first dates' best friend that wants to tag along.
We started seriously training him before that first hunt was even over and, by the next year, he was somewhat passable as a caller.
By the next year, he was very convincing.

We may have dumped him after that first year.... but, man! That guy can cook!

[bnsafe]

lol, so theres the key, being a good cook will keep you in camp.

[eriks.]

Just throwing this out there for you guys that might feel the need to take a newbie under their wing...I'm more than a fair cook (ask my family)! Pretty good pack mule too! Don't cuss, smoke, drink, do drugs and mostly control my smart aleck mouth. Am I over-selling myself here?

[easeup]

what is your favorite movie?

[bnsafe]

jeramiah johnson, am i in, lol.

[eriks.]

To Kill A Mockingbird.

I appreciate Gregory Peck's characters quiet determination and sense of right and wrong. Classic American novel!!

[co_bowhunter]

Great advice here. This is a great time of year to spend significant time studying Google Earth, make a list of what constitutes great elk habitat, and begin planning for scouting trips as soon as the snow melts. I avoid trailheads for the reasons stated above. Some of the best elk hunting is
right off a major highway where there is barely a place to pull off the road, hike straight up and into an elk basin and you know you'll have the place to yourself. There are many places like this. Most never think to investigate them. Avoid 4WD roads completely and anything where ATV's are present.

I hope this helps.

[eriks.]

I forgot to mention that I also like- Pina Coladas and getting caught in the rain, I'm really not into yoga and it turns out that I only have half a brain.

[GetemDuck]

My trailhead just happens to be where ever I park my truck to get to where i want to hunt, that might be a parking area or it might just be a wide spot in the road or my truck in the ditch....

[bnsafe]

so when im lookin at a nat forest map and see parking areas i dont have to park there, i can park anywhere the car stops and start hunting?

[mtnmutt]

For those new to forest service roads out west: carry a bow saw or chain saw in your vehicle.

When the monsoons come, trees fall and sometimes block the road. This happen to me on a scouting trip. All clear going in and 2 days later the road was blocked on the way out by a very mature newly fallen aspen. It would have been a good excuse not to show up for work on Monday, but I was lucky or unlucky to pivot it off part of the narrow road.

[cnelk]

mtnmutt speaks wise words about carrying some sort of saw.

There are millions of NF acres in CO that include forest roads that have beetle killed trees.
They can fall at any time.

I have a chainsaw in my truck at all times and numerous occasions I have had to cut trees that have fallen after I drove down the forest road.

[mtnmutt]

bnsafe,
As long as you do not block anything like gates, the road or intersecting roads; you are fine.

They grade most of the roads in summer, but sometimes they are out there on weekends which happened to me one summer. So be mindful during summer scouting of any grading ops going on.

2 years in a row, they were doing work along a forest service road the first week of CO archery. This year its not likely since it starts one week later with labor day weekend.

[GetemDuck]

chainsaw chainsaw chainsaw I never head up the hill without one in the truck, just like cnelk i've had to cut my way back and would not have been able to cut through 3 trees with a hand saw. I bought an 18" poulin saw off ebay for 30.00 shipped to my door and it has more then earned it's keep.....lol

[WapitiTalk1]

On the chainsaw thing, a good tow chain or cable is a handy thing to have in the tool box also.

[cnelk]

And a come-a-long

No tree will stand a chance

[cnelk]

dbl post

[bnsafe]

now theres some valuable info i would never had thought of. awesome and thanks guys